Dialogues with secularists/modernists – Page 18

Lost virginity, peer pressure and explicit music

Jerry Sexton I was virgin until my 20s, and never cursed. My friends pressured me to curse on high school graduation night, they had never heard me say objectionable words. My point is that I don’t think music plays a role nearly as much as peer pressure.

Ishmael Abraham I was forced to eat Indian sweets last week while being the co-bridegroom of my cousin on his marriage, and when I became angry, they said that the fun lies in the pressure. But my introvert personality has helped me to avoid conformism through reduced social circle.

09/09/2020

Islam and reformative/unjust gheerah: Narcissism and traditional/liberal Pharisees

I have low IQ and relatively secular family members who have immigrated to Australia due to higher income there. Since I have family members who suffer from NPD, I enjoyed your articles about economic and violent forms of narcissism. Since, I am involved a lot in intrafaith Scriptural dialogue so I understand the Scriptural ignorance and psychological weaknesses of the violent faithful. There has been some research on NPD and marital infidelity which is more common in West. Psychologists have also talked about healthy self-love. I think being happy if your spouse is sexually faithful is healthy self-love. But since the global impact of sexual revolution, this healthy self love is hurt although in controlled amounts in East, so Pharisees of our culture are guilty of violently reacting to narcissistic mortification. To overcome that I have a vision of a psyche- sensitive pronomianism to overcome both traditional Phariseeism and modern liberal Phariseeism. Thanks for being though provoking. 🙂

https://www.theguardian.com/profile/anne-manne

09/09/2020

Quora: Bible, Quran and a violence free tomorrow

Has there been an attempt to create a violence-free Bible?

The sacred texts classify violence into two categories. The physical violence(qital) and the spiritual violence(fitna) and as Quran teaches that being tempted is more horrible than being injured or martyred because temptations kill the soul which is eternal while martyrdom only kills the body of the believer. So, we see that early Christian martyrs were fearless because they fear faithlessness more. Now, we should think about what Bush calls pre-emptive violence as opposed to defensive violence. The concept of spiritually pre-emptive politics can be both heroic and destructive like the views of Simon the disciple and Maccabees who revolted against Hellenistic threats to faith, but Jesus peace be upon him was inclusive of both assertive views of Simon and compromising views of Matthew. So, we we want a humane political vision of religion, we should try to channel the spiritual zeal of the assertive people into a movement for political reform rather than violently suppressing them and stigmatizing them, then we can achieve a Biblical hermeneutics which can contribute to a violence free tomorrow.

09/09/2020

Quora: Islam, existential anxiety and thanatophobia

Daniel Fawcett

May 2, 2014 · 1 upvote

I knew the concern of life affirming religions would occur. Fear stemming from religious beliefs traditionally follows from, as you said, ” that particular religion may be right and if I acknowledge it I then have to take responsibility for my actions or suffer catastrophic consequences ‘on the other side’”

Now with the trend shifting scientific advancement and skepticism taking precedence over going to church, mosque, synagogue in 1st world countries, people get angry or derisive (emotions fueled by fear*) because many religious beliefs seem as far fetched as most fairy tales. Perhaps it angers people because they believe it to be an act of ignorance to believe in such fairy tales.

I’m still developing an opinion regarding why people would reject religion for the wrong reasons.

Maybe anger is a separate emotion from fear in some cases. but that’s a question for another thread.

Ishmael Abraham

Just now

Quran talks about misotheistic/angry non-faith as well as how faith inspires existential anxiety and awakens the moral anxiety, and we tend to feel euphoric rather than dealing with existential dysphoria. So, one can call it euphoria-seeking escapism than a phobia. People have talked about thanatophobia. Phobia is an intense form of anxiety. The more we do not deal with existential anxiety in daily life due to being more involved in temporal affairs after the industrial and sexual revolutions, there is high probability of this developing into full fledged thanatophobia or Islamophobia.

Ishmael Abraham

Just now

Although Islam is more life-affirming than Christianity, but since as a reaction to historical life denial in Christianity, the modern culture takes life affirmation to higher levels, so even Islamic moderate life affirmation seems as primitive leading to a form of anti-traditionalist xenophobia which can be seen from the economic lens of class conflict. Knietzsche understood how Islam is more life affirming than Christianity but modern atheism has lack of empathy due to cultural narcissism their classical predecessors tried to overcome.

09/09/2020

Quora, narcissism and Islam

David Moore, author

Answered Mar 10, 2016

Thanks for the A2A, but….
What??? WHAAAAAT????
Either you have no understanding about what the narcissistic personality disorder is about or you have no understanding of Islam or religion in general. Now as for some of the radical leaders in contemporary Islam, I think you could make a case for that. There certainly are many who exhibit some pretty extreme behavior patterns consistent with narcissism and its handmaidens, paranoia, delusions of grandeur and obsessive/compulsive disorder. That at very best is a twisting of the religious precepts to serve their own agenda.
The thing about religion is that it tends to be the very opposite of narcissistic. It is about the “other”, not about the self. Look at the five pillars of Islam: Faith, Prayer, Charity, Fasting and Pilgrimage to Mecca. They are all about getting past ones self, even self denial, and moving into closer relationship with Allah (God) and being a conduit of God’s blessing to the world. Narcissism is extreme self centeredness. Islam is extreme ‘other’ centeredness. Polar opposites.

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· 1 Upvote

Ishmael Abraham

Just now

Some researchers have discussed the correlation of healthy narcissism and industrial progress, so a lack of industrial revolution in Middle East is a sign of high self-annihilation. But Hadith teaches: wa linafsika alayka haqqun: Your biological and physical self has rights too. So, Islam has has a buffer to extreme Buddhist self denial which secular Buddhism seeks to cure which is already cured within sacred texts of Islam.

https://www.quora.com/Are-the-Contemporary-Muslims-Narcissists

BigMouth • 5 months ago

I am married to someone who has “talked to God.” He let’s me know that when the end times come (right around the corner), I will get what’s coming to me because I didn’t believe him. We were strong, traditional Catholics. He joined an internet cult that claims to be Catholic, and never looked back. The cult is a tight circle that has decided they are end-times prophets with secret knowledge, tells everyone else to WAKE UP and closes anyone with mainstream beliefs out. I am the one threatening to divorce. I am not a narcissist. This “article” has some truth, but my delusional husband would read this and see me in it. It’s dangerous to label a narcissist in a nutshell. Those abused by narcissists often need to employ their tactics to survive. It’s not as easy as 15 memes

Ishmael Abraham BigMouth

I am an orthodox Muslim electrical engineer from Pakistan, and my father is a man of faith but he suffers from narcissism due to an over critical mother who in turn suffered childhood trauma due to early death of her father. Before, I studied narcissistic pathology, I chose flight or fight, but now I have chosen the path of empathy and what Stephen Covey calls the third alternative. This alternative requires high EQ and high level of empathy. The bestsellers suggest that such people are too complex to be close to, but I think if we succeed in the missions impossible, we can make earth a better place to welcome the blessed advent of the Abrahamic King Messiah, peace be upon him.

http://www.beliefnet.com/faiths/galleries/15-narcissistic-religious-abuse-tactics.aspx

09/09/2020

An American secularist criticizes an ignorant Christian for being unkind to me on my birthday :)

ISHMAEL ABRAHAM·FRIDAY, 1 DECEMBER 2017

Jerry Sexton Thomas, Allah is never mentioned in the Bible, but “Elah”, which is a generic term for God was used, and not in the context that you use with inserting your own words into scripture. It seems to me that you use much of your time on Abraham’s wall to express your hatred, and you don’t even take a break from it on his birthday. Is this the real Christianity?

Ishmael Abraham I love his ignorant faith more than the militant non-faith of those atheists uninformed about Islam. 😉 And, you are neither militant nor uninformed 🙂

Julie Darlene Skidmore Like Nicodemus, one can be religious and not be born again.

Ishmael Abraham But one should not be like Marcion too 🙂

Jerry Sexton I would love to be with my grandparents again. I wish there were an afterlife, I wish that it was as easy as making a choice.

Ishmael Abraham

Were your forefathers Catholics, because Sexton is apparently a catholic concept. I wanted to be the sexton of my village Mosque, but I finally chose not to be like Buddha. 🙂 Otherwise, if I remained as a sexton there, I could not have known a descendant of Christian sextons 🙂 Try reciting Rabbi Yassir a lot if you like especially before sleeping because sleep is a simulation of death which means O God make it easy for me. Overcoming existential dysphoria is possible with divine grace if we are ethically and metaphysically curious. I also pray for you. Rabbi Yassir lahu. O God make it easy for him. Today, Pakistanis celebrate the non-orthodox birthday of our Ishmaelite Hero in imitation of your forefathers’ celebrations of Christmas. Thanks for being kind to me on my birthday and Mawlid 🙂

09/09/2020

Thanking a complimentary Shia friend, after God made me see the Shia-Sunni complementarity :)

ISHMAEL ABRAHAM·FRIDAY, 1 DECEMBER 2017

Hussain Murtaza Dr Muhammad Iqbal didn’t have Facebook when he was 29. You must be a genius to be diversely well educated and knowledgeable at 29. My Android isn’t too comfortable with Facebook these days, I apologize if the “complimentary” note is a short one.

Hussain Murtaza It is really getting on my nerves how often people confuse “complimentary” and “complementary.”

If I say nice things about you, then I am giving you a compliment and so I am being complimentary (note the “i” in the middle). If you and I have different skills that make us work together in a more complete way than we could do individually, we complement each other. So we are complementary (note the “e” in the middle). See “complimentary” and “complementary” at Merriam-Webster for more information.

The version to use when you mean that something is free is “complimentary.”

Ishmael Abraham Thanks for being complimentary. I thank One God for seeing the Shia-Sunni complementarity. Dr. Iqbal is said to visit orthodox scholars Anwar Shah Kashmiri and Abul Hasan Ali Nadwi. But we need a greater pious modernist- orthodox traditionalist complementarity. I can see such complementarity in relationship of Mustafa Tabatabai and Ayatollah Borqei.

09/09/2020

Deliberately provocative Christians make me think about VVF, Hindu women and Baal

ISHMAEL ABRAHAM·FRIDAY, 1 DECEMBER 2017

Dieter Verhoeven

While there is some linguistic cross-over, it’s very clear when one digs into details of numerous references that the Yahweh God of the Judeo-Christian frame is distinct from the Allah of the Islamic frame and that this Islamic concept is featured in the bible prominently as Ba’al. There is no interchangeability between Yahweh and Allah and they are not synonymous. The suggestion otherwise is just ignorant.

This is just a statement of uncontroversial fact. What one does with that is up to them.

Thomas Edward Morgan Jr.Dieter Verhoeven, no kidding.

Christians are to be like Christ Jesus to the church to women. Jews hold a Pentateuch giving more written rights to women than all other documents ever written summed up prior to 1930 A.D. and thus if women want to avoid the curse of the fall they ought to contemplate marrying a Jew or a Christian.

By comparison, Hindu women confronted with Islam killing their husbands threw themselves into the funeral fire to be burned to death, than to be in a Islamic harem of the curse of the fall.

And we all know little girls in Islam are burning themselves to death or going to medical institutions from the West in their area to get their “Vestico-vaginal Fistula” fixed up to be halfway healthy again in the region of their vagina.

Ishmael Abraham According to Quran 37:125, Allah loves Elijah peace be upon him called Ilyas and hates Baal too. The founder of evangelical Tabligh movement in Islam was also named after Elijah peace be upon him.

Ishmael Abraham If you think Hindu women hate Islam, learn about Hindu poetess Lata Haya and Hindu activist Arundhati Roy.

https://yasirimran.wordpress.com/2010/09/22/hindu-poet-lata-haya-praising-islam/

Ishmael Abraham I think both Muslim and Christian women, as in Nigeria, suffer from VVF. Both of us respect Sarah peace be upon her but there is a story that she asked Abraham peace be upon him to pierce the ears and circumcise Hagar peace be upon her, but we never blame the grandmother of Jesus peace be upon him, for that, so Jews and Christians should learn about their own history before blaming Islam out of jealousy and ignorance. And, secularists also have a role to play, if they force us to accept pornographic modernity, more traditionalists will avoid dialogue with modernists and more of them will perpetuate the weaknesses of traditional culture. So, we should work together to reform both traditional and modern weaknesses.

Ishmael Abraham Dieter, may God bless Thomas with your patience too 🙂

09/09/2020

Thanks God for knowing a religious scholar and a swimmer

ISHMAEL ABRAHAM·FRIDAY, 1 DECEMBER 2017

Tank McNamara

Ishmael Abraham

Both ignorant secularists and ignorant believers might think that swimming is a secular activity, but learned orthodox Muslims see it as a spiritual activity.

Isaiah 43:2 When you pass through water, I am with you. 🙂

http://hadithanswers.com/virtue-of-swimming-in-hadith/

09/09/2020

An interculturally synergetic sister introduces me to the modern Catholic Tolkien

ISHMAEL ABRAHAM·MONDAY, 27 NOVEMBER 2017

Ishmael Abraham Elvish is a linguistic concept and I have explored the concept of a divine proto-language. The sacred Abrahamic texts indicate that there will be a future universal spiritual language. So, I try to be eloquent writer of both ancient and modern languages.

Kimber’el Eventide thank you Ishmael Abraham! Indeed, the Elvish language Tolkien created is a “sample” of what light language can do for a species and how it elevates them getting them in touch with their divineness created by a divine source we all come from.

Ishmael Abraham If I had met Tolkien and CS Lewis I would have passionately described to them how Quran ecumenically resolves their denominations. Tolkien considered his mother a martyr of faith. He also leaned towards anarchism and I would have explained to him how a sacred democratic utopia can make anarchism unnecessary. :)Thanks for being a marvelous feminine inter-cultural bridge and being thought provoking.

Kimber’el Eventide Ishmael Abraham My pleasure! it is true. Tolkien would have understood the slight mysticism in the Quran and the glory of Oneness, he would get.

Ishmael Abraham You are right. Tolkien would have appreciated the mystic side while CS Lewis would have preferred the exegetical side. Both are complementary. Mysticism helps overcoming intellectual egoism and lack of praxis and exegetical approach helps overcoming the mystic ineffability and antinomian egoism.

Kimber’el Eventide Ishmael Abraham and another thing is Tolkien can go beyond cultures and see the truism of all religions. He was able to bring pagan/monotheism together as the Quran suggested once that the people belong as one great family.

Ishmael Abraham Rene Guenon has worked on the idea you have suggested and it is called perennialism. Quran sees paganism as an offshoot of primordial monotheism because we tend to grow closer in love to the physical manifestations of light instead of the Divine Source. So, first and greatest commandment teaches that the we should make the love of created lights subordinate to the love of The Light (An Nur).

Kimber’el Eventide Ishmael Abraham I will have to read about Rene Guenon then 😉

Ishmael Abraham Ha ha. Born in France and died in Egypt. He was a muhajir (Quranic term for a migrant for God) who left his home for God so his last word was Allah. I am agoraphobic so I cannot be as great as him. Just like Tolkien used allusions to European mythology, he used allusions to Hindu mythology of the Hindu ancestors of Pakistani unitarians.

https://hollowverse.com/j-r-r-tolkien/

I should commend that during interfaith and intercultural debates this is the best resource to briefly relate to famous western personalities, because Islam is basically defined by a unitarian theology and a sacred democratic political philosophy. A western sister who admires Quran introduced me to Tolkien and this article contributed to interfaith and intercultural dialogue. Thanks.

09/09/2020

Category: Dialogues with secularists/modernists