How to reconcile text and reason in traditional world

ishmaelabraham

In the traditional world, the reconciliation of text and reason was often approached through the study and interpretation of religious texts. For example, in Christianity, the Bible was seen as the authoritative source of truth, and scholars worked to understand and interpret its teachings through the use of reason and critical thinking.

One approach was to use a method called exegesis, which involved analyzing the text to understand its original context, the intended meaning of the author, and how it might be relevant to contemporary issues. This involved a careful study of language, history, culture, and philosophy.

Another approach was to use a method called hermeneutics, which focused on interpreting the text in light of broader philosophical and theological principles. This involved a more abstract and conceptual analysis of the text, drawing on concepts such as metaphysics, epistemology, and ethics.

Overall, the reconciliation of text and reason in the traditional world was a complex and multifaceted process, requiring a deep understanding of both the text and the broader intellectual and cultural context in which it was situated. It was a process that involved careful scholarship, critical thinking, and a commitment to truth and understanding.

Ishmael Abraham is with Rasheed Gillespie and 2 others.
15 October at 17:03

I think Shafiis are better than Hanafis and Salafis because they seek compromise and reconciliation between text and intellect.

Rasheed Gillespie So be Shāfi`ī then 🤔🙄
Ishmael Abraham Rasheed Gillespie When is the process of switching schools supposed
Rasheed Gillespie Ishmael Abraham Just pick whichever one’s usūl make most sense to you and stick to it, bro. It’s fiqh, and you’re not a faqīh.

(Sorry but fiqh isn’t really that important to me.)

Ishmael Abraham Rasheed Gillespie الفقیہ أشد علی الشیطان من ألف عابد
Rasheed Gillespie Ishmael Abraham I don’t think the word فقيه was being used as a technical term for “jurisprudent” back when (and if) the Prophet عليه و آله الصلاة و السلام spoke it…
Ishmael Abraham But not a term for us modern متکلمین as well
Rasheed Gillespie Ishmael Abraham I don’t consider myself a متكلم… I have questions, I do research, كلام is my area of interest. Bas 😉
Ishmael Abraham

الحمدالله علي نعمة العطش الكتب هاها
Rasheed Gillespie Ishmael Abraham *عطش العلم و الحق
Romito Olaguer Very Confusing way.
Husna Hameed Romito Olaguer Like deists and protestants
محمد بن محمد خالد Didn’t Shafism give birth to Salafism, with their hadith centrism and false notion of ijma?
Ishmael Abraham

محمد بن محمد خالد Are you Hanafi or Maliki or Hadith denier
Rasheed Gillespie

محمد بن محمد خالد
Kinda was the beginning of the end 🧐
محمد بن محمد خالد Ishmael Abraham I’m someone who rejects the man made institutionalized religion Islam.
Ishmael Abraham Rasheed Gillespie Shafii admired Muhammad the student of Abu Hanifa.
محمد بن محمد خالد That’s supposed to be a good thing lol
Ishmael Abraham Are you atheist or deist
Rasheed Gillespie Ishmael Abraham Okay he admired him… and? Muhammad al-Shaybani was also a hadith-centric scholar.
Rasheed Gillespie Ishmael Abraham He’s Muslim in the linguistic sense.
Ishmael Abraham And, Abu Yusuf and Zufar?
Rasheed Gillespie Ishmael Abraham Abu Yusuf yes, Zufar no. Zufar was usūl/ra’y-centered and a Mu`tazili.
Ishmael Abraham When I read about Zufar. جمع بين الفقه و العبادة I started loving him. He is sufi kind of Mutazili like Iqbal.
Ishmael Abraham Any evidence for Mutazili zufar
Ishmael Abraham Do you like linguist Abu Hayyan.
Ishmael Abraham Who was Quran centric
Rasheed Gillespie Ishmael Abraham Only that Shaykh Atabek Shukurov has told me that Imam Zufar was the head of the Basri Mu`tazila of his time.
Rasheed Gillespie Ishmael Abraham Abu Hanifah and Zayd b. `Ali `alayhi salam were Qur’an-centric from what I understand.
Ishmael Abraham The homeland of Shaykh Atabek is very secular which can be due to complacency of taqlid.
محمد بن محمد خالد Secularism has its advantages, otherwise you’d have one version of Islam being forced upon everyone.
Ishmael Abraham My father is Quran centric but I have seen the dark side of it. He is a wonderful philosopher but is a very opinionated anti traditionalist to the point of narcissism.
Ishmael Abraham If Mutazilis didn’t integrate with Abassid state, we could have a respected soft anti sectarian secularism in middle east.
Rasheed Gillespie Ishmael Abraham Dunno what Uzbekistan’s overall secularism has to do with anything, bro…
Rasheed Gillespie Ishmael Abraham I’m trying to revive a Mu`tazilism somewhat as you described. Much writing to do.
Ishmael Abraham Aren’t most Uzbeks Hanafis by birth who have no idea what a legal school stands for.
Rasheed Gillespie Ishmael Abraham I suppose they are, but Shaykh Atabek is a scholar; his father was a scholar and his mother was an academic.

Ishmael Abraham Muhammad Asad was a kind of Sola Scriptura Mutazili whose Tafsir is banned in Saudi Arabia.
Rasheed Gillespie Ishmael Abraham Yes when I feel lazy I use his translation.
Ishmael Abraham Due to his Jewish background, apolitical Salafism appealed to him.
Rasheed Gillespie Ishmael Abraham Salafism to me is like voluntary autolobotomy… but that’s due to my having been raised as a Vulcan 🖖🏻🤣
محمد بن محمد خالد Rasheed Gillespie Mu’tazili thought’s always been present throughout all schools besides Salafism.
Ishmael Abraham Salafis are the most self aware Sunnis in the traditional world. They spoiled their public image through aggressive apologetics. Semi European Albani has tried to buffer their aggression, but westerners have geopolitical argument to raise alarm about Salafi bogeymen.
Ishmael Abraham Many Zaydis are Mutazilis. I like Asharis and Maturidis who like Shafiis seek reconciliation and compromise.
محمد بن محمد خالد Can you really compromise without losing your principles?
Ishmael Abraham In initial phase, no. But when the other side chooses to be less narcissistic it becomes possible
Rasheed Gillespie Ishmael Abraham You actually can’t compromise, not in any effective and intellectually consistent way. “Compromise” usually ends up being nothing more than mentally gymnastic, ad hoc justification for cramming a tradition in where it don’t fit (or just straight up ignoring self-contradiction when it happens).
Ishmael Abraham The idea of rajih(preferable) helps. This is how pious and humble scholars of past behaved. No one will ever be able to claim monopoly over truth which is recipe for political abuse. I acknowledge Mutazili contribution to Quranic studies like Zamakhshari while opposing Mutazili abuse and narcissism which gave literalists a sense of moral superiority. And, Mutazilis need to study Asharis and Maturidis and they rigorous attempt to optimize paradoxes.

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