A spiritual Ishmaelite

Bernard Lonergan a Catholic theologian says Trinity is without understanding but he also says God is utterly simple.

Kirby Hopper Well that makes a whole lot of sense now doesn’t it?

Leon Taylor-Hargreaves Shalom Aleichem! Let trinitarians believe in their trinity concept. God allots to the goyim their idols and false concepts of G-d but Israel is G-ds portion(Devraim32:8). The trinity dogma is the result of centuries of philosophical speculation on the nature of G-d and Messiah. The so called ”church fathers” and theologians interpreted scripture from the perspective of Plato, Socrates, Heraclitus, Aristotle etc. They did not recognise or understand the Hebraic mindset which is the foundation of the Tanakh, Besorah(Gospels) and the Netzarim Ketuvim(apostolic writings). It was inevitable that they reached the conclusion of a tri-personal god dogma. Constantine needed a standard doctrine of God in order to unite the divergent factions in Christendom. Trinitarianism eventually won, sending the other major competitor(Arianism) for the hearts and minds of the faithful into obscurity. Once begun, the church could never reverse the downward trajectory it was on. Under the Gentiles, nascent Christianity moved from absolute monotheism, a fully human ”Jesus”, notional pre-existence etc, towards a compromised monotheism. When all theological debates end, all threats and intimidation fails, trinitarian apologists resort to their walled city. And that walled city is that the trinity is an incomprehensible mystery. Hebraics aren’t concerned about scoring points and winning debates. We concern ourselves with living, faith, good deeds, teshuvah, following and practicing the teachings of Rav Yeshua ben Yosef. It is about treating others fairly, justice, right doing, loving even our enemies, forgiving, building a society that shares and cares. Our energies and talents are more useful in those areas than trying to prove that we are superior in knowledge to others. Deeds are more important than creeds.

Ishmael Abraham We call him Yeshua bin Maryam

Leon Taylor-Hargreaves To those of us of Ebionite/Nazarene persuasion, Yeshua is the son of both Yosef and Miriyam, his biological parents. He grew up in a normal Jewish family, had siblings, learnt Torah, attended synagogue, kept the festivals, was bar mitzvah’d, cried, laughed, played and lived like any normal child would. He was declared the son of G-d(a Messianic title) at his baptism. The Tanakh gives us 3 classes of messiahs(anointed ones), prophets, priests and kings. Yeshua was begotten from the dead to become the first born of a new creation that would inherit the Kingdom(Malkuth ha Elohim). Eternal life is entered only through resurrection from the dead. That is the pillar and foundation of our faith. A man was anointed by YHVH(Baruch haShem Adonai), a man was executed for proclaiming righteousness and the Kingdom of G-d, a man was raised up from the dead, a man ascended to the right hand of G-d, a man recieved power and authority from the Royal Majesty on High, a man was glorified above the angels and heavenly beings, a man will return again. Peace be upon him, Yeshua our Messiah.

Ishmael Abraham By the way, Bible never says he laughed. :)However, Hadith texts teach that the Ishmaelite Prophet peace and blessings be upon him laughed. We find that inaccurate because we consider smiling a sunnah of all Prophets.

Leon Taylor-Hargreaves Don’t concern yourself about such issues, Ishmael Abraham. The haba ha olam(the coming world/age) under Messiah will be a time of great learning and reconciliation. G-d will reclaim all the nations(including both of pours) to himself. Brother will not lift sword against brother, men will melt their weapons of bloodshed, violence and war into instruments of farming. We will all learn and live, side by side under the rule of G-d through Messiah. We are practicing now for that day. We are expending our lives so that in that Day we will be countered worthy of entrance in that land, the beautiful city of G-d. Hostility between Israelite and Ishmaelite will cease, the colour of a man’s skin will no longer be the measuring line of whether he is in or out. We have to bear testimony in this present evil age of the one to come. We testify against this age through brotherly love, forgiving one another, seeking peace and justice, removing injustice and unrighteousness far from our hearts, compassionate, understanding and loving by deeds of kindness and mercy. Yes, Ishmael, loving even those who disagree with us, who practice contrary to us, loving through kind deeds those who abuse and mistreat us for the witness we bear. We have the courage to live in the manner the Teacher of Righteousness taught us. Therefore we do not fear, for the witness within is greater than the turmoil without.

Chris Westerman When Messiah returns God will re-establish Paradise and there will be no more sin, tears, sorrow, pain or hurt. All those who have rejected the one true God and his son will be destroyed. Only those who love God will live eternally.

Leon Taylor-Hargreaves Ishmael Abraham, there is a portion of the Torah where the brothers, Ishmael and Isaac reconciled. In Bereshith 25:7-8 it is recorded thus; Then Avraham breathed his last and died in a good old age, an old man of full age(175) and was gathered unto his people. And his sons Isaac and Ishmael buried him in the cave of Machpelah, which is before Mamre, in the field of Ephron, son of Zohar the Hittite. In the Kingdom of G-d all tongues, tribes and nations will be reconciled in Messiah and blessed in our father, Avraham(Peace Be Upon Him).

Leon Taylor-Hargreaves Our little flock in South Africa is not permitted to denigrate or insult the prophet of Islam. He brought monotheism and a measure of Torah to the pagans of Arabia and beyond. While we may disagree on many things, we do agree on the absolute oneness of G-d, Amein.